The Lake of FIRE...

[willieH]

willieH: Hello to all...

This thread will be a discussion about The LAKE of FIRE...

1. What is it?
2. Where is it?
3. When is it?
4. What is its PURPOSE?
5. What is its DURATION?
6. Why did NOT, ...JESUS nor ANY of the PROPHETS mention it?

Look forward to your answers... to all SIX questions!

(hint: all these questions can be answered in 6 words or less )

peace... willieH

[willieH]

willieH: Howdee!

Just woke up and found no takers on this thread, though there is much more detail and Scriptural foundation, Let me giveya the "less than 6 word" answers:

Originally Posted by willieH

willieH: Hello to all...

This thread will be a discussion about The LAKE of FIRE...

1. What is it? THIS LIFETIME
2. Where is it? HERE ON EARTH
3. When is it? NOW
4. What is its PURPOSE? TO TEACH US GOOD AND EVIL
5. What is its DURATION? OUR INDIVIDUAL LIFETIMES
6. Why did NOT, ...JESUS nor ANY of the PROPHETS mention it? IT IS THE REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST

peace... willieH

[Rick]

Well Willie you`ve done a good job of convincing yourself that the lake of fire doesn`t exist. But the problem with your view is that it doesn`t agree with the declarations about the lake of fire found in the Bible. It kind of like the serpent in the garden of Eden when he told Eve "Ye shall surely not die".

I also read your free will post. I can see that the real cause of your personal torment is the Calvinist extremist doctrine that decieves you.

I can see why the truth is so hard for you to accept . You have my sympathy.

[willieH]

willieH: Hi Rick...

Rick`s remarks in ( )

I do not mean to condescend Rick, but you are in need of correction... and what I say, though it may sound harsh here & there, is intended in LOVE...

( Then don`t because your insults are staring to annoy me.)

How weak is this post Rick... powerless, and without the WORD of God to substanciate it's assertions...

( We are talking about the lake of fire here and I assumed that you had actually read the verses found in the book of Revelation on the topic. If you haven`t then don`t talk about something you haven`t read about. The scriptures on the lake of fire are very matter of fact, cut and dry. No need to quote them.)

Originally Posted by Rick

Well Willie you`ve done a good job of convincing yourself that the lake of fire doesn`t exist. But the problem with your view is that it doesn`t agree with the declarations about the lake of fire found in the Bible.

Oh really?

Says who? YOU?

( No. The book of Revelation says and for your information this site is pro Bible. Obvious you don`t believe what the Bible says and some of your remarks betray your lack of objectivity and borline on being unacceptable.)


Ps 90:9 For ALL OUR DAYS are passed ALWAYS IN Thy WRATH; we spend OUR YEARS as a TALE that is told.

Rom 1:18 For the WRATH of God ...IS REVEALED from Heaven against all Ungodliness and Unrighteousness OF MEN who hold the TRUTH in unrighteousness.

( You seem to think that you can use one scripture to negate another. It doesn`t work that way. Foolishness to believe that it does.)


This post of yours is hardly an answer, it is at best an opinion... and quite a weak one at that...

( My post isn`t an opinion. It`s a matter of fact remark about what the book of Revelation says. What is weak is your denial of what God`s word plainly says.)

I am VERY CONVINCED that the Lake of Fire exists... but unlike yourself, who reads SPIRITUAL words with NATURAL eyes,

I read the Revelation of JESUS CHRIST, as a Spiritual Book, which is written SYMBOLICALLY... as IT informs of its content: (Rev 1:1) SIGNIFIED means via SIGNS

( What you are telling me is that you read scripture and then you reinterpret the words to mean whatever you want them to.)

A book about the REVEALING of LOVE done from the alpha to the omega of ALL THINGS... not just "Christian" religionists who luxuriously bathe in their
self-saving, religious fallacies...

(Believing what the Bible says isn`t a fallacy. Reinterpretation of scripture to mean whatever you want it to say is however. It is perversion of the gospel.)

As the Scriptures I opened with show, we are AMIDST the WRATH of GOD ...NOW... you don't accept it, well... la-dee-da... that is your choice.

( There is wrath of God right now but that doesn`t change what the Bible tells us about the judgement.)


And as a religious "CHRISTIAN", ...like your sisters before you, the JEWISH RELIGION... you (unknowingly) seek to put TRUTH to DEATH... failing to see beyond your flesh, what is in the SPIRIT...

( I knowingly believe what the Bible tells me. I don`t go around making up meanings for scripoture that aren`t in there.)

You have not answered the questions... only made an incorrect, clumsy and very shallow observation of me...

( Nothing incorrect, clumsy or shallow about it. The fact is you don`t believe in the scriptures and you make up meanings that suit your own desires. You rationalize in your mind so that you can believe the Bible is telling you what you want to hear.)

It kind of like the serpent in the garden of Eden when he told Eve "Ye shall surely not die".

NOT! ...it is kind of like: GOD LOVES us ALL, ...just as the Bible says He does... YHVH GOD does NOT CHANGE -- (Mal 3:6), neither does CHRIST -- (Heb 13:8)... so when He says:

( The Bible doesn`t say God loves everyone.)



John 3:16-17

16 God SO LOVED the WORLD, that He gave His only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life...

17 For GOD ...SENT NOT... His Son to CONDEMN the WORLD, but that THE WORLD, through Him might be
SAVED...



It means He SO LOVED the WORLD, ...STILL LOVES the WORLD, and ALWAYS WILL LOVE the WORLD...

And it means that if HE SENT NOT His Son to CONDEMN, then He DOES NOT SEND His Son to CONDEMN, and NEVER WILL SEND His Son to CONDEMN the WORLD... HE SO LOVES!

( It says whosoever will. It doesn`t say everyone will because everyone won`t.)


Of course you do not BELIEVE what the WORD says, you only believe what has been fed you by RELIGION... and in the name of RELIGION do you oppose what IS SAID in the WORD...

( I believe everything the Bible says. The unbeliever here is you.)

I preach the GOSPEL which is GOOD NEWS only... Look up the 2 Greek words Rick...

( You preach a heresy that will lead people to hell and if anyone perishes because of the false gospel you are proclaiming then you yourself will face judgement for that.)

Euaggelion and Euaggelos... they are rooted in 2 Greek Words Rick... EU=GOOD and AGGELOS=MESSENGER



Unlike yourself who teaches GOD to be an INFINITE TORMENTOR... weak, unmerciful, ...unable to reconcile the race HE created, ...which fell IN ADAM... which is HIS WORK... (Eph 2:9-10 -- John 6:44 -- John 12:32)


( You make the accusations of the devil. The gospel I uphold is a gospel of hope. Your gospel is the wide path to destruction.)

We do not SAVE ourselves... as you teach... by some lucky decision made by an unbiblical... "sinners prayer" or... "decision for CHRIST" ...Where are these in SCRIPTURE Rick? Btw... I won't hold my breath for you to find them...

( You have no basis to make such a lying accusation. Obvious you haven`t read my stuff. And no, I don`t care to reference scripture for you. It would be a waste of my time. You are seripusly decieved by the devil.)

GOD is NOT the "Hitleresque" being which YOU propose that He is... Making Himself ETERNALLY ANGRY...


( The Bible states that sin angers God and talks about his wrath in a number of passages. You call the righteous indignation of a Holy God "Hitleresque". That`s the devil talking there. You are a false teacher with another gospel.)

He has PURPOSE for this life and the suffering in it, but of course, RELIGION has suffocated your ablity to see beyond the physical, ...and just as the scribes and pharisees before you... You would rather keep your feet comfortably in the Babylon which GOD calls you OUT of... (Rev 18:4) that you might fit IN with the MANY... go ahead... you are welcome to do so... You shall find regret at the end of your journey...

( Insults accompanied by the devils threats. The real you is showing. You are full of bitterness and hostility towards the truth of the gospel.)

I also read your free will post. I can see that the real cause of your personal torment is the Calvinist extremist doctrine that decieves you.

You again make me laugh...

( Oh I don`t think you are laughing Willie. You don`t like being confronted with the truth.)

You only show you know little of Calvinism... Though I am admittedly not versed in their RELIGION, ...I DO KNOW that Calvinism believes that only the FEW "elect" shall be saved... They believe in the very same HELL that YOU DO...

If either of us is aligned with Calvinism, it is you... for I reject both of those views... and YOU adopt both...


( You point of view that God does not give man freewill was invented by Calvin. No freewill is the foundation that Calvinism is built on. You are a Calvinist whether you admit it or not.)



I am a believer in the Salvation of ALL MEN

( Yeah I get that. That is a doctrine of hell designed to take people to hell.)


They are MANY, and you add yourself to their number... blindly walking the pathway of Destruction... wide, accomodating, led by MEN and not GOD...

( I thought you believed everyone was saved? Oh maybe just everyone except for people who believe in the Bible. )

[Rick]

willieH: Hi Rick...

Rick`s remarks in ( )

I do not mean to condescend Rick, but you are in need of correction... and what I say, though it may sound harsh here & there, is intended in LOVE...

( Then don`t because your insults are staring to annoy me.)

How weak is this post Rick... powerless, and without the WORD of God to substanciate it's assertions...

( We are talking about the lake of fire here and I assumed that you had actually read the verses found in the book of Revelation on the topic. If you haven`t then don`t talk about something you haven`t read about. The scriptures on the lake of fire are very matter of fact, cut and dry. No need to quote them.)

Originally Posted by Rick

Well Willie you`ve done a good job of convincing yourself that the lake of fire doesn`t exist. But the problem with your view is that it doesn`t agree with the declarations about the lake of fire found in the Bible.

Oh really?

Says who? YOU?

( No. The book of Revelation says and for your information this site is pro Bible. Obvious you don`t believe what the Bible says and some of your remarks betray your lack of objectivity and borline on being unacceptable.)


Ps 90:9 For ALL OUR DAYS are passed ALWAYS IN Thy WRATH; we spend OUR YEARS as a TALE that is told.

Rom 1:18 For the WRATH of God ...IS REVEALED from Heaven against all Ungodliness and Unrighteousness OF MEN who hold the TRUTH in unrighteousness.

( You seem to think that you can use one scripture to negate another. It doesn`t work that way. Foolishness to believe that it does.)


This post of yours is hardly an answer, it is at best an opinion... and quite a weak one at that...

( My post isn`t an opinion. It`s a matter of fact remark about what the book of Revelation says. What is weak is your denial of what God`s word plainly says.)

I am VERY CONVINCED that the Lake of Fire exists... but unlike yourself, who reads SPIRITUAL words with NATURAL eyes,

I read the Revelation of JESUS CHRIST, as a Spiritual Book, which is written SYMBOLICALLY... as IT informs of its content: (Rev 1:1) SIGNIFIED means via SIGNS

( What you are telling me is that you read scripture and then you reinterpret the words to mean whatever you want them to.)

A book about the REVEALING of LOVE done from the alpha to the omega of ALL THINGS... not just "Christian" religionists who luxuriously bathe in their
self-saving, religious fallacies...

(Believing what the Bible says isn`t a fallacy. Reinterpretation of scripture to mean whatever you want it to say is however. It is perversion of the gospel.)

As the Scriptures I opened with show, we are AMIDST the WRATH of GOD ...NOW... you don't accept it, well... la-dee-da... that is your choice.

( There is wrath of God right now but that doesn`t change what the Bible tells us about the judgement.)


And as a religious "CHRISTIAN", ...like your sisters before you, the JEWISH RELIGION... you (unknowingly) seek to put TRUTH to DEATH... failing to see beyond your flesh, what is in the SPIRIT...

( I knowingly believe what the Bible tells me. I don`t go around making up meanings for scripoture that aren`t in there.)

You have not answered the questions... only made an incorrect, clumsy and very shallow observation of me...

( Nothing incorrect, clumsy or shallow about it. The fact is you don`t believe in the scriptures and you make up meanings that suit your own desires. You rationalize in your mind so that you can believe the Bible is telling you what you want to hear.)

It kind of like the serpent in the garden of Eden when he told Eve "Ye shall surely not die".

NOT! ...it is kind of like: GOD LOVES us ALL, ...just as the Bible says He does... YHVH GOD does NOT CHANGE -- (Mal 3:6), neither does CHRIST -- (Heb 13:8)... so when He says:

( The Bible doesn`t say God loves everyone.)



John 3:16-17

16 God SO LOVED the WORLD, that He gave His only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life...

17 For GOD ...SENT NOT... His Son to CONDEMN the WORLD, but that THE WORLD, through Him might be
SAVED...



It means He SO LOVED the WORLD, ...STILL LOVES the WORLD, and ALWAYS WILL LOVE the WORLD...

And it means that if HE SENT NOT His Son to CONDEMN, then He DOES NOT SEND His Son to CONDEMN, and NEVER WILL SEND His Son to CONDEMN the WORLD... HE SO LOVES!

( It says whosoever will. It doesn`t say everyone will because everyone won`t.)


Of course you do not BELIEVE what the WORD says, you only believe what has been fed you by RELIGION... and in the name of RELIGION do you oppose what IS SAID in the WORD...

( I believe everything the Bible says. The unbeliever here is you.)

I preach the GOSPEL which is GOOD NEWS only... Look up the 2 Greek words Rick...

( You preach a heresy that will lead people to hell and if anyone perishes because of the false gospel you are proclaiming then you yourself will face judgement for that.)

Euaggelion and Euaggelos... they are rooted in 2 Greek Words Rick... EU=GOOD and AGGELOS=MESSENGER



Unlike yourself who teaches GOD to be an INFINITE TORMENTOR... weak, unmerciful, ...unable to reconcile the race HE created, ...which fell IN ADAM... which is HIS WORK... (Eph 2:9-10 -- John 6:44 -- John 12:32)


( You make the accusations of the devil. The gospel I uphold is a gospel of hope. Your gospel is the wide path to destruction.)

We do not SAVE ourselves... as you teach... by some lucky decision made by an unbiblical... "sinners prayer" or... "decision for CHRIST" ...Where are these in SCRIPTURE Rick? Btw... I won't hold my breath for you to find them...

( You have no basis to make such a lying accusation. Obvious you haven`t read my stuff. And no, I don`t care to reference scripture for you. It would be a waste of my time. You are seripusly decieved by the devil.)

GOD is NOT the "Hitleresque" being which YOU propose that He is... Making Himself ETERNALLY ANGRY...


( The Bible states that sin angers God and talks about his wrath in a number of passages. You call the righteous indignation of a Holy God "Hitleresque". That`s the devil talking there. You are a false teacher with another gospel.)

He has PURPOSE for this life and the suffering in it, but of course, RELIGION has suffocated your ablity to see beyond the physical, ...and just as the scribes and pharisees before you... You would rather keep your feet comfortably in the Babylon which GOD calls you OUT of... (Rev 18:4) that you might fit IN with the MANY... go ahead... you are welcome to do so... You shall find regret at the end of your journey...

( Insults accompanied by the devils threats. The real you is showing. You are full of bitterness and hostility towards the truth of the gospel.)

I also read your free will post. I can see that the real cause of your personal torment is the Calvinist extremist doctrine that decieves you.

You again make me laugh...

( Oh I don`t think you are laughing Willie. You don`t like being confronted with the truth.)

You only show you know little of Calvinism... Though I am admittedly not versed in their RELIGION, ...I DO KNOW that Calvinism believes that only the FEW "elect" shall be saved... They believe in the very same HELL that YOU DO...

If either of us is aligned with Calvinism, it is you... for I reject both of those views... and YOU adopt both...


( You point of view that God does not give man freewill was invented by Calvin. No freewill is the foundation that Calvinism is built on. You are a Calvinist whether you admit it or not.)



I am a believer in the Salvation of ALL MEN

( Yeah I get that. That is a doctrine of hell designed to take people to hell.)


They are MANY, and you add yourself to their number... blindly walking the pathway of Destruction... wide, accomodating, led by MEN and not GOD...

( I thought you believed everyone was saved? Oh maybe just everyone except for people who believe in the Bible. )

[willieH]

willieH: Hi Rick...

Once again, a SCRIPTURE-LESS reply... I'll answer it later, (got painful fluid on my left knee, and must attend to it - pray for me, for CHRIST requires you to!)

But really, if you wish to prove what you believe, YOUR WORDS are not that which shall SUBSTANCIATE it before others, you shall have to show that the WORD of GOD says what YOU SAY...

By the way, I will ALWAYS use Scripture to refute your foolishness bro... You dont have Scriptural basis for your RELIGION, so you avoid using it...

There are countless men leading countless sheep down the pathway of Destruction... I am one man... on a computer.

(Btw... the word Destruction is APOLLUMI... you would do yourself a service to find out the meaning of this word, and where it is used (#G622 strongs)

You are so stuck in the sand of RELIGION that you cannot see your own folly...

Peace... willieH

[Rick]

There are countless men leading countless sheep down the pathway of Destruction...

( You spend all this time denying God`s judgements and then you turn around and affirm them when it suits you. LOL! Get a grip Willie and accept the truth.)

[rodger]

Good day
Willie
To answer your Question in six words as follows: (In the centre of the earth)
Why brim stone? To erase data

I will tell you where I think hell is later in this letter but first,
All we need to do is love God with all our hearts and mind soul and strength
And love thy neighbour like you love yourself, do you think by senseless words to each other would please our lord.? Are doing that? We love the word of God the Bible but we must be careful we are not vain in doing so
To lead us to become ignorant which leads to arrogance in their reasoning with each other.
We need to speak in reason with one another Through the Holy Spirit together as we all know there are different spiritual Gifts that we have from the members of Christ. And if we as Christians slandering through self-righteousness will we bear fruit for Christ to give to our father?
We are self confess sinners and by the Grace of God we have been reconciled and now receive the reconciliation.

Now I will give note my thoughts on were hell is.

God created an (abode) the gates around the deepness of darkness, which we call space, Behold God’s space of mind, and all Creation, come through the reconciliation of Gods Reason of intention (Meaning). Nobody has seen the reason of intention (meaning) of God but the reconciliation (Jesus Christ)

God throne is the highest heaven it could be recognised as the third heaven is all around space the universe and the 24 elders surround God Throne in
Other words God surround the 24 elders.

God will clean evil out of his space of mind (The universe) as we must clean our evil out of our space of mind by the help of the holy spirit once confess.

For we are Created in the image and likeness of God himself making us Gods. That’s why I said in the other post we were destined to know Good and evil as God does, but the end result for those confess will be raised from corruptible to incorruptible bodies.


Hell is a place of isolation and as I belief the fiery brim stone is the second death. The death of mind, by eliminating memory in our given space
So the Given seed may be refined and reused.

The Jail is in the centre of the earth waiting for judgement, Where our lord spent Three days after his Death.

But hell is in my view in the centre of the abode.
I will post a drawing on this subject.


This is my reason in the Holy Spirit I believe for when you ask knock and seek you will be answered.

God bless
Meaning Reconciliation Creation

[willieH]

willieH: Hi Rick...

I promised an answer, here it is... btw... thanks for praying for me and my knee condition... you DID pray for me didnt you?

It was quite painful... and I cannot walk at the moment...

willieH: I do not mean to condescend Rick, but you are in need of correction... and what I say, though it may sound harsh here & there, is intended in LOVE...

RICK: Then don`t because your insults are staring to annoy me.

Want a little cheese with that ..."WHINE"?

You have no idea of how INSULTING I could be with you. I have been a pro-musician for over 40yrs, and have dealt with many of the most UNRULY humans on the planet!

willieH: How weak is this post Rick... powerless, and without the WORD of God to substanciate it's assertions...

RICK: We are talking about the lake of fire here and I assumed that you had actually read the verses found in the book of Revelation on the topic. If you haven`t then don`t talk about something you haven`t read about. The scriptures on the lake of fire are very matter of fact, cut and dry. No need to quote them

The book of REVELATION is a SYMBOLIC book Rick... and if you wish to discuss the LAKE of FIRE... you must realize that it is NOT a LAKE as you would percieve, and it is NOT a FIRE as you would percieve...

These are (1) SYMBOLS and are also (2) SPIRITUAL Words...

The REVELATION of JESUS CHRIST is exactly what it says: THE revealing OF LOVE...

It is NOT to be taken or understood in LITERAL terms... nor shall it be understood by many, for within it, it challenges often, "He that hath an EAR, let him HEAR what the SPIRIT says unto the Churches."

RICK: No. The book of Revelation says and for your information this site is pro Bible. Obvious you don`t believe what the Bible says and some of your remarks betray your lack of objectivity and borline on being unacceptable.

No matter how you put it RICK... your understanding or lack of it concerning the REVELATION of JESUS CHRIST, is YOUR UNDERSTANDING, ...not what the "bible SAYS"...

I have already pointed out that you do NOT observe and agree with what the BIBLE SAYS, in previous posts which you avoid and fail to acknowledge, because YOU KNOW you do not RECOGNIZE the WORD for what IT SAYS...

When discussing the SYMBOLIC book of Revelation... the WORDS therein are COMPLETELY figurative or Symbolic, and are pointed to other Scriptures which must be compared to them in order to gain understanding...

willieH:

Ps 90:9 For ALL OUR DAYS are passed ALWAYS IN Thy WRATH; we spend OUR YEARS as a TALE that is told.

Rom 1:18 For the WRATH of God ...IS REVEALED from Heaven against all Ungodliness and Unrighteousness OF MEN who hold the TRUTH in unrighteousness.

RICK: You seem to think that you can use one scripture to negate another. It doesn`t work that way. Foolishness to believe that it does.

You are really self decieved aren't you bud...

I just used TWO Scriptures which SHOW AGREEMENT with one another, one in the OT, and one in the NT...

willieH: This post of yours is hardly an answer, it is at best an opinion... and quite a weak one at that...

RICK: My post isn`t an opinion. It`s a matter of fact remark about what the book of Revelation says. What is weak is your denial of what God`s word plainly says.

No Scripture, no TRUTH... just OPINION...

GOD's Word plainly says He will SAVE ALL... and you deny them...

(1 Tim 4:9-11 / 1 John 14:4 / 1 John 2:2 / 1 tim 2:3-6 / 1 Cor 15:22)

Well ...DO-YA?

willieH:
I am VERY CONVINCED that the Lake of Fire exists... but unlike yourself, who reads SPIRITUAL words with NATURAL eyes,

I read the Revelation of JESUS CHRIST, as a Spiritual Book, which is written SYMBOLICALLY... as IT informs of its content: (Rev 1:1) SIGNIFIED means via SIGNS

RICK: What you are telling me is that you read scripture and then you reinterpret the words to mean whatever you want them to.

It is YOU which do this... try those verses above RICK... they say what they SAY... you DENY what THEY SAY...

What part of ALL MEN do you not understand RICK?

willieH:
A book about the REVEALING of LOVE done from the alpha to the omega of ALL THINGS... not just "Christian" religionists who luxuriously bathe in their
self-saving, religious fallacies...

RICK: Believing what the Bible says isn`t a fallacy. Reinterpretation of scripture to mean whatever you want it to say is however. It is perversion of the gospel.

That's the problem bro... you dont BELIEVE what IT SAYS... you change the wording to fit your THEOLOGY... it is YOU that "REINTERPRET"

BIBLE VERSION: 1 Tim 2:3-6 For THIS is GOOD and ACCEPTABLE in the sight of GOD our SAVIOR... who WILL HAVE ALL MEN TO BE SAVED... and to come to the knowledge of the TRUTH, for there is ONE GOD and ONE mediator between GOD and Man, the MAN CHRIST JESUS, who gave Himself a RANSOM for ALL to be TESTIFIED in DUE TIME..

RICKS VERSION: 1 Tim 2:3-6 For this is okay, and not acceptable in the sight of God our Savior... who WILL HAVE SOME MEN TO BE SAVED... and to come to the knowledge of the TRUTH, for there is ONE GOD and ONE Mediator between GOD and Man, the MAN CHRIST JESUS who gave Himself a RANSOM for SOME to be TESTIFIED in DUE TIME...

Well? Isnt that how you read it RICK?

willieH: As the Scriptures I opened with show, we are AMIDST the WRATH of GOD ...NOW... you don't accept it, well... la-dee-da... that is your choice.

RICK: There is wrath of God right now but that doesn`t change what the Bible tells us about the judgement.

It tells us about the JUDGMENT:

(Is 26:9) with all my soul have I desired thee, in the night; yea, with my spirit within me will I seek thee early, for WHEN THY JUDGMENTS are IN THE EARTH, the INHABITANTS of the WORLD will LEARN RIGHTEOUSNESS.

You portray JUDGMENT to be a bad thing... it is NOT! It is a WONDERFUL THING... it is a TEACHER... which changes HEARTS...

You entirely miss the Scriptures RICK, ...which is WHY you do not use them! You are ASHAMED of them... and UNLEARNED of them... and you wish me to have the same SHORTCOMING, but have found me DEDICATED and an AVID STUDENT, ...more than you can handle...

So you resort to threats... and do not do what CHRIST taught you to do... LOVE your enemies, BLESS them which CURSE YOU... instead you fail miserably at representing our SAVIOR...

willieH: And as a religious "CHRISTIAN", ...like your sisters before you, the JEWISH RELIGION... you (unknowingly) seek to put TRUTH to DEATH... failing to see beyond your flesh, what is in the SPIRIT...

RICK: I knowingly believe what the Bible tells me. I don`t go around making up meanings for scripoture that aren`t in there.

None so blind as are you Rick... you REFUSE to see... I have used Scripture over and over to prove my points... you have done NOTHING but blab your opinions, and TAKE MY WORDS out of CONTEXT... you think GOD is not WATCHING US?

There will be a record of this interaction come before Him... You can bet on it... and it will show me as PROUD of HIS WORD, and it will show me STUDIED in that WORD, and it will show YOU as an OPINIONATED man without the ROCK to stand on...

willieH: You have not answered the questions... only made an incorrect, clumsy and very shallow observation of me...

RICK: Nothing incorrect, clumsy or shallow about it. The fact is you don`t believe in the scriptures and you make up meanings that suit your own desires. You rationalize in your mind so that you can believe the Bible is telling you what you want to hear.

I have used the SCRIPTURES you HAVE NOT... end of discussion...

You have NAMED NOTHING using the SCRIPTURES which are to be USED in CORRECTION (2 Tim 3:16) and REPROOF... but you do not even use them at all... rather you swim in your folly, drowning yourself in it...

willieH: NOT! ...it is kind of like: GOD LOVES us ALL, ...just as the Bible says He does... YHVH GOD does NOT CHANGE -- (Mal 3:6), neither does CHRIST -- (Heb 13:8)... so when He says:

RICK: The Bible doesn`t say God loves everyone.

Do you even HAVE a Bible Rick? GOD does NOT CHANGE and says this:

John 3:16-17

16 God SO LOVED the WORLD, that He gave His only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life...

17 For GOD ...SENT NOT... His Son to CONDEMN the WORLD, but that THE WORLD, through Him might be
SAVED...



It means He SO LOVED the WORLD, ...STILL LOVES the WORLD, and ALWAYS WILL LOVE the WORLD...

And it means that if HE SENT NOT His Son to CONDEMN, then He DOES NOT SEND His Son to CONDEMN, and NEVER WILL SEND His Son to CONDEMN the WORLD... HE SO LOVES!

RICK: It says whosoever will. It doesn`t say everyone will because everyone won`t

Of course they WILL Rick... You are just a blind man without a cane...

Phil 2:10-11 That at the NAME of JESUS, EVERY knee should BOW of Heaven and In EARTH, and under the Earth, ...And EVERY TONGUE shall CONFESS that JESUS CHRIST is LORD to the GLORY of GOD the Father...

Also see Rom 14:11

Which are quotations about the SAVED which come from:

Is 45:22-23 Look unto Me, and be YE SAVED, ...ALL the ENDS of the EARTH; for I am GOD and there is NONE ELSE... I have sworn by MYSELF, the WORD is gone out of My MOUTH in RIGHTEOUSNESS, and SHALL NOT return, that UNTO ME... EVERY KNEE shall BOW, EVERY TONGUE shall SWEAR...

God is NO RESPECTER of DIRT LUMPS Rick... of which you and I are numbered... He LOVES those, because He gave them LIFE... and JESUS DIED for them ALL... (John 1:29 / Heb 2:9)

Of course you do not BELIEVE what the WORD says, you only believe what has been fed you by RELIGION... and in the name of RELIGION do you oppose what IS SAID in the WORD...

RICK: I believe everything the Bible says. The unbeliever here is you.

Because I don't believe as do you, you name me an UNBELIEVER... get a life... I BELIEVED before you were barely out of diapers...

You do NOT believe EVERYTHING the Bible SAYS... I have more than thoroughly outlined those DISBELIEFS.

willieH: I preach the GOSPEL which is GOOD NEWS only... Look up the 2 Greek words Rick...

RICK: You preach a heresy that will lead people to hell and if anyone perishes because of the false gospel you are proclaiming then you yourself will face judgement for that.

HERESY? Heretical against what? YOU? Please...

I stand against the FALLACIES of BABYLON in which you are thoroughly IMMERSED... Of course that is HERESY to you... just as it was to the PHARISEES... Your RELIGION has been objected to, so you deduce that objection as HERESY... Please, Jeff Foxworthy doesnt top the humor of your ridiculous words Rick...

You only make yourself look foolish, as you LACK the WORD of GOD in your posts... then object to what I say WITH IT... Give me a break dude!

willieH:
Euaggelion and Euaggelos... they are rooted in 2 Greek Words Rick... EU=GOOD and AGGELOS=MESSENGER

Unlike yourself who teaches GOD to be an INFINITE TORMENTOR... weak, unmerciful, ...unable to reconcile the race HE created, ...which fell IN ADAM... which is HIS WORK... (Eph 2:9-10 -- John 6:44 -- John 12:32)

RICK: You make the accusations of the devil. The gospel I uphold is a gospel of hope. Your gospel is the wide path to destruction.

The GOSPEL is GOOD NEWS... your news stinks... and is hardly GOOD... I preach that GOD LOVES ALL... which He DOES... You tell folks that GOD loves them, then if they dont BELIEVE YOU... they are going to HELL...

Get a grip Rick... you preach with a FORKED TONGUE... telling the World that GOD loves them, then in the next instance CONDEMN (which JESUS did not do)... them to HELL... There is a HELL alright, and YOU and your tainted message, are in it...

Not a GOSPEL (Good news) which teaches LOVE... rather a WORKS oriented, SELF BASED, JUDGMENTAL foolery which is CONDITIONAL and TWO FACED... and as backward as the JEWS which crucified our Savior...

willieH: We do not SAVE ourselves... as you teach... by some lucky decision made by an unbiblical... "sinners prayer" or... "decision for CHRIST" ...Where are these in SCRIPTURE Rick? Btw... I won't hold my breath for you to find them...

RICK: You have no basis to make such a lying accusation. Obvious you haven`t read my stuff. And no, I don`t care to reference scripture for you. It would be a waste of my time. You are seripusly decieved by the devil.

A "waste of TIME" to quote the WORD of GOD? Is THIS how you LOVE your enemies Rick? Is this how you BLESS ME? Is this how much you care about me, that in my supposed "ERROR" it would be a WASTE of YOUR TIME to CORRECT ME with SCRIPTURE?

Listen to yourself!

Your words continue to be your own... the words of a SINNER... a "RICK" with no ROCK to stand on...

You have no argument, probably dont even have a BIBLE... and you think to represent the LORD?

willieH: GOD is NOT the "Hitleresque" being which YOU propose that He is... Making Himself ETERNALLY ANGRY...

RICK: The Bible states that sin angers God and talks about his wrath in a number of passages. You call the righteous indignation of a Holy God "Hitleresque". That`s the devil talking there. You are a false teacher with another gospel.

No YOU are the FALSE TEACHER, using nothing but YOUR OWN WORDS to verify yourself...

You teach that the GOD OF LOVE, shall be ETERNALLY angry with FINITE beings which HE created, KNOWING BEFOREHAND, that they would do what they do... Your picture of GOD is so debased, that it portrays HITLER by comparison to be the tooth fairy...

BURNING mercilessly FOREVER, creatures which HE brought into this world... ETERNALLY VENGENT?

I feel sorry for you Rick... you dont even have a Bible, or if you have one, ...obviously you have never read it... one or the other...

One day maybe... you shall awake from your lazy and UNSPIRITUAL slumber and STUDY, with an HONEST HEART... and then you shall REGRET the studpidity you have displayed here.

willieH: He has PURPOSE for this life and the suffering in it, but of course, RELIGION has suffocated your ablity to see beyond the physical, ...and just as the scribes and pharisees before you... You would rather keep your feet comfortably in the Babylon which GOD calls you OUT of... (Rev 18:4) that you might fit IN with the MANY... go ahead... you are welcome to do so... You shall find regret at the end of your journey...

RICK: Insults accompanied by the devils threats. The real you is showing. You are full of bitterness and hostility towards the truth of the gospel.

Listen to who is talking, ...two quotes earlier in this post:

RICK: The Bible states that sin angers God and talks about his wrath in a number of passages. You call the righteous indignation of a Holy God "Hitleresque". That`s the devil talking there. You are a false teacher with another gospel.

AND before that:

RICK: You preach a heresy that will lead people to hell and if anyone perishes because of the false gospel you are proclaiming then you yourself will face judgement for that.

All from a guy that believes in the WORD? Which says:

(Matt 7:1) JUDGE NOT that ye be NOT JUDGED?

willieH: You again make me laugh...

RICK: Oh I don`t think you are laughing Willie. You don`t like being confronted with the truth.

You have yet to present any! Your "TRUTH" is your own jive... baseless, unbelieving SCRIPTURE, blaming ME for the ZITS on your own face!

willieH:
You only show you know little of Calvinism... Though I am admittedly not versed in their RELIGION, ...I DO KNOW that Calvinism believes that only the FEW "elect" shall be saved... They believe in the very same HELL that YOU DO...

If either of us is aligned with Calvinism, it is you... for I reject both of those views... and YOU adopt both...

RICK: You point of view that God does not give man freewill was invented by Calvin. No freewill is the foundation that Calvinism is built on. You are a Calvinist whether you admit it or not.

As I said previously, YOU have MUCH MORE in common with CALVINISM than do I... Because CALVINISTS believe there is no FREE WILL... does not mark me of their breed...

I believe JESUS CHRIST is the Savior, so do CATHOLICS, this belief does not make me a CATHOLIC...

I believe in the gift of TONGUES... that does not make me a PENTACOSTAL... I believe in PROPHECY... that doesn't make me a psychic... PLEASE dude! Get a grip!

As I said in the quote... YOU are more aligned with them, then am I...

willieH: I am a believer in the Salvation of ALL MEN

RICK: Yeah I get that. That is a doctrine of hell designed to take people to hell.

You get the bozo prize... it is a doctrine which is designed to SAVE ALL... which is WHAT CHRIST came to DO:

Luke 19:10 For the SON of MAN is come to SEEK and to SAVE, ...that which is LOST... (apollumi)

YOU believe He failed... I believe He WAS COMPLETELY VICTORIOUS... no HELL in that mission... just LOVE and SALVATION...

HELL belongs to YOU and all who PROMOTE it to the WORLD... and it shall SHAME YOU on JUDGMENT day.

willieH: They are MANY, and you add yourself to their number... blindly walking the pathway of Destruction... wide, accomodating, led by MEN and not GOD...

RICK: I thought you believed everyone was saved? Oh maybe just everyone except for people who believe in the Bible.

You hardly believe in the Bible Rick... you actually believe in the "DOCTRINAL statement" of the Church you go to...

As for me, ...I do believe ALL will be saved, RICK (even you - lol)... that does not mean that even the slightest UNHOLINESS shall be a part of that SALVATION...

Your "GOSPEL" is to throw the baby out with the bathwater... instead of washing and cherishing that little one... and getting rid of what is NOT necessary, such as the poop in his diaper, and the mud on his t-shirt...

I'm sure you believe you are going to be saved, ...what's holy about YOU?

The word DESTRUCTION is APOLLUMI (#G622 - strongs) which is used in the verse above, Luke 19:10... it is also used in the parables of the LOST Son, the LOST coin, and the LOST sheep... which eventually, in time, were ALL FOUND...

DESTRUCTION is to be done... but MEN are not to be destroyed... GOD loves ALL MEN... it is that portion of them which is UNRIGHTEOUS and UNGODLY and UNHOLY that shall be DESTROYED (1 Cor 3:11-15)

This will definitely INCLUDE the false "GOSPEL" you pretentiously, and ignorantly present to others... which displays our LOVING God as a PSYCHO, mercilessly bullying FOREVER, a creation that could not help ITSELF...

Miserably failing to teach YHVH as the KIND and SWEET, LOVER of His Creation... that He ...IS...

You teach others that HE is ETERNALLY VINDICTIVE, that He is ETERNALLY ANGRY, that He is full of FURY... which is ACTUALLY the condition of MEN in SIN...

GOD teaches to FORGIVE, and to LOVE the UNLOVEABLE, and to bring the GOSPEL of PEACE to the WORLD, ...not just to a few in the pews... that look down their RELIGIOUSLY JUDGMENTAL noses at the rest of the WORLD..

I think they ironically got called, "PEWS" because the message of those sitting in them, ...STINKS!

CHRIST didn't bother with the Pharisees, Scribes, Sanhedrin, High Priests etc... because they were the RELIGIOUS of their day, and because the worshipped the OUTWARD, and watched for the OUTWARD, when the HOLINESS of REVELATION comes from WITHIN...

Try studying sometime RICK, maybe then you might have viewpoints which are applicable and proveable...

If you really believe in HELL, and you are DEVOTED to it as a message Rick... then you better spend your every hour, and every cent, and every ounce of energy to warn others, or all you amount to is just another RELIGIOUS HYPOCRITE which is INDIFFERENT enough not to be about "wasting his time" with such activities as saving lives...

You better rid yourself of your phony facade, and get with your message... that is, ...if you really believe it.

Until then little brother, you will remain just another RELIGIOUS windbag.

Peace... willieH

[rodger]

It was quite painful... and I cannot walk at the moment...
Where is your faith bro?

Until then little brother, you will remain just another RELIGIOUS windbag.
You have no reasoning with other christians if you class yourself as having the gift of teaching